and forcing my self to not shrug off what would be refered to as trivial mistakes

and bad judgement

at the tail end of the 2010s

welcome back tomman

Tracking issue for CF issues on rpmo

I learned them .. too well

clownflare strikes again

"Clownflare Siege, Day 46"

the latest HN thread cooled down even before warming up

in the meanwhile, the Clownflare Agent is hellbent at having their demands met - they're now demanding a timeline to implement some of the missing features

a timeline from MCP

lol

so far there hasn't been any approach to any of the other affected browsers, other than a vague promise of establishing a sort of "Trusted Browser" crapola program

it was a fuckin war to get a consistant release schedule

nsITobin: let's be realistic, no FOSS project like ours can get anywhere near a timeline

that's like asking cows to produce cheese

they may be able to pull it off but tehre would be fallout and consiquences if pushing that fast

and that's exactly what Clownflare is now demanding, because they firmly believe that any "concession" they make on our browsers will "weaken" their mafia product

again, a Ukraine vs. Trump situation

Don't

do not equate MCP with Ukraine

I'm bagging ALL OF US, not just PAle Moon

we're the victims here, remember?

Yeah

we have been for a long time

Anyway, the situation remains at a stalemate, and negotiations have proved to be a farce where Clownflare wants to keep their pie ANd eat it

But I think it is a trap. There is a narative that has been building past year that non-corperate backed open source cannot be trusted and the worth of a project is dependant on how many people contribute rather than output produced

yep, that's the Silly Con Valley mindset

where FOSS without a monetization path is basically Soviet malware

Pale Moon is not any kind of entity and the most hostile mozilla related group this side of NT6

i fear they will be played

and if your project is not backed by big VC capital, then it's irrelevant and should not be used, EVER

I find amusing that the latest stupid rumour there is "Apple will buy Ladybird eventually" just because the Ladybird dev uses Apple tech like Switft

that could be a self fullfilling prophacy tho

hype about it would get apple's attention

maaaaaaaaybe... in 10 years, when Ladybird becomes a relatively complete product?

i am sure apple is kinda over their hard stolen khtml code driving google and microsoft's control of web standards

but why Apple would ditch Webkit after pouring decades of manpower and billions of dollars on it?

why is mozilla dropping every Netscape and early Mozilla technology just line by line?

over a decade

and a half

ha, the complaint I hear usually is "Apple is holding the web back with Safari because it doesn't innovate as fast as Chrome"

(it doesn't indeed help the illegal MICROS~1-esque monopoly Apple has on their cellphones and non-computers with Safari)

phoronix.com/news/Theora-libtheora-1.2-Beta speaking about blasts from the past

I still think I caused this

all of it

the cloudflare stuff

when I went to the whatwg and told them at the end I would use a XUL Browser to endrun their standards body just like they did to the W3C.. and well XUL Browsers are specifically under attack across the board.

nah, Clownflare happened because they got blind by the Googlebux

yeah but this seige could be my fault

because all these companies conspire with each other

the standards are just a pretense

they just hate diversity (no, not the DEI one) because that's "extra work, yo"

it's the IE era all over again

except that Chrome is actually well liked because each release comes with new shiny toys for bored nerds

unlike IE which was basically medieval punishment

tomman: I am pretty sure that's what I said during some moments of lucity when I was still raging about .. everything

like in 2023

Basically the modern crop of webdevs see Chrome tech as the "eternal youth fountain"

and nothing else matters

it's like the web being the new OS (again because Chrome empowers that - Microsoft's approach with ActiveX was clearly the wrong one, and so it was Java)

these modern web devs have to deal with a very dark world out their window

gah I am running behind on things again...

uBlock Origin Legacy (uBO) security concerns

in there is mentioned UCyborg's fork that seemly has ported the fix over

(myself, i'll just live dangerously)

oh, & from what i recall, if i recall correctly ?, it does run in SeaMonkey

therube: and when was the last time someone checked if it STILL runs.. both UXP and 253 have breaking changes to extensions and it is difficult at best to target firefox and suite when it was on the same platform .. it may work MOSTLY but is it specifically cared for for seamonkey? That is what matters when it comes to Mozilla Extensions..

certainly not specifically catered for SM... but if someone wants to try...

well it won't be me.. I'll fudge ABPrime over first

cloudflare, forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?p=260812#p260812

therube: we were discussing that earlier, but yeah, all I can see is a loooooooong stalemate

Clownflare is not really willing to give us some margin, are they?

> Note that we may need to instrument anonymised aggregate traffic analytics for the PM UA as it is likely that bot developers would start leveraging this in nefarious ways.

it's all because The Bots™

(in the meanwhile you routinely see bot makers at Hackernews saying they can easily bypass all and any of Clownflare's antibot crapola)

yeah I noticed that

also, the Clownflare dude really contradicts himself

"no, we don't rely on user agent strings to identify browsers"

"yes, we actually do"

"no, not really"

"but we may need to collect data"

well he is doing ok on not being completely unreasonable and the community is doing a decent job backing up and supporting what is said while getting a jab in every so often.. But Moonchild's biggest weakness is he is not prepared for a long term showdown.. Eventually he may cave for an easier path for Just Them(tm) or break and play into the stratagy I think is at play.

if his fanfic skills start showing on what he is telling the community.. we will know..

and there is where we should enter

because once Clownflare is done chewing him, it's our turn next :/

Moonchild will have to step up and be the leader he so desperately wants to be which means looking out for more than your own shit.. This I believe is his test.. He has had more than enough time for some form of de-tobinization and retains every last benefit of it.. He has new contributors and the community seems on the same page.. what he DOES with it will determine a lot about the future..

Hi all. uBlock 1.16.6.0 is fine. Just updated from his previous beta.

cool

I usually test this and NoScript. If it were not for NoScript we would have more more backports but hold off. Wish someone would fork it. I applied some private fixes for obsolete stuff so far.

As for clownflare. Can we stop the discussion. It goes nowhere and becomes pointless. I rather would like to discuss SeaMonkey shortcomings or possible enhancements. Best if soneone even does them :)

oh,that reminds me

how about pdf.js?

does anyone have a newer compatible version I can install here?

is it an extension or a toolkit component?

I've been finding some PDFs that fail to render at all lately, including real ancient stuff from the mid '90s

but then I'm using the final public release of a fork that just turned... what, five years old?

I'm amazed at the fact it still works without the need for fixes

which fork

github.com/IsaacSchemm/pdf.js-seamonkey this one

In theory we have newer code in our tree. I wanted to look into it for ages but...

well this things should be on a list somewhere

yes in the meeting notes

for integrated pdf.js of course the normal fe code but also shellservice needs updated to be aware it is a target for pdfs

if i recall correctly hooks in content handler shellservice and glue

are needed

of course Mozilla handled it in a very strange way unlike any other previous or future bundled extension

this extension is nothing like the code in-tree

i am confused here

yes was adapted to SeaMonkey with some stuff. One of the reasons we can't just bundle the integreted stuff 1:1

oh

this shit is node generated then wrapped with a pseudo-extension

okay that makes sense

... so why didn't they just keep it like the code in browser?

Wanted to look into it for ages but it not something I personally want anyway so it gets moved to the next meeting and the next and ....

I prefer opening suff in an external pdf reader.

same

I don't understand how this node abomination produces a mozilla extension

tomman: do you know anything about this?

i don't think there is a way to gut and maintain this simpler .. someone is gonna have to lrn how to maintain this thing and conduct more backports

task 99999

well next year should it arrive

try and look into it.. I don't know anything about node though

Rust's developer community forum does not work on non-free browsers, or if JavaScript is disabled. Instead it has "overflow-y: hidden !important;" for its html body so that the page cannot be scrolled down and the user always sees the top banned that tells to download a "supported" (non-free) browser

does not work on free browsers, I meant to write

Those supported browsers are Firefox, Chrome and Safari...

Sompi: is that Dischorse, er, Discorpse, er, Discourse?

because Dischorse has such a self-sabotage mode if it detects a browser that doesn't fit Jeff's Vision™

it CAN gracefully degrade, and the proof is that once you disable that CSS rule (and some booby trap with jQuery and links), forums work fine (at least for read-only, I do not recommend using Disscourse as an actual forum user)

of course if you complain at Discourse's "bug tracker" (which is nothing but another Discourse forum instance!), you will be dismissed, locked out, and potentially banned

tomman: do you come to that conclusion from observation for empirically?

tomman ;)

or*

Harzilein: I've been lurking at Discourse boards since Jeff convinced TDWTF's owner to deploy that dogvomit there

spoilers: the locals had a field day every day breaking the darned thing :D

outages were common, and Jeff Atwood is on record having said that any computer older than 5 years is inadequate for Discourse

5 years, nice. so at least we won't be _worse_ off than businesses who can actually write them off

(TDWTF eventually triggered a meltdown at Jeff's, and got banned from Discourse, they migrated to NodeBB and remain there, almost a decade later)

remains the waste of resources...

FWIW, NodeBB works fine on SeaMonkey, doesn't crash your server 30 times a day, and can be paginated

(it's still overkill for a forum software, I'll stick to phpBB or similar 'till the cold death of the universe)

has the pgp key for the mozilla hierarchy been lost?

or did it not have one in the first place?

netscape

w/e

oldest _spam_ visible from here in mozilla.support.seamonkey is from 2011

tomman: wanna help me write a minimal forum?

nothing as grandious as phpbb

those already exist

where?

they're called "whatever trash they use in Japan" :D

yeah but a good one

so anyone know anyone that goes by the username the_fsf?

nope