21:27:44 <tomman> https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42645218 not sure if to laugh or cry
21:27:54 <tomman> FWIW, this doesn't work on the ancient pdf.js build I have here
21:28:00 <tomman> so... I'm safe?
21:29:54 <nsITobin> tomman: I wonder how many years it has been since I pushed for removing pdf.js from Pale Moon...
21:30:18 <nsITobin> for this very eventuality (cause keeping it actually up to date was the other choice)
21:30:19 <tomman> I actually always hated browser plugins for PDF, but then that's Adobe trauma for ya~
21:30:29 <tomman> but yeah, PDF is just a too complex format for its own good
21:30:32 <tomman> again, blame Adobe
21:30:35 <nsITobin> i prefer plugins for alien content
21:31:15 <nsITobin> I'd prefer flash or silverlight for video
21:31:30 <nsITobin> but going that route I have even more demands
21:31:37 <nsITobin> because why wouldn't i lol
21:31:39 <nsITobin> tomman
21:34:02 <tomman> PDF became a web standard for me many moons ago, when we figured out that the only way to send HTML to that printer and not end destroying your nerves was... hard render it to PDF :D
21:34:16 <nsITobin> PDF is NOT a web standard
21:34:24 <nsITobin> its not a web format at all
21:34:42 <nsITobin> it has no business being displayed as if it was an html page or image without specialized software
21:34:58 <nsITobin> if js an extension then but a plugin is my choice
21:35:04 <nsITobin> or an external client
21:35:06 <nsITobin> is even better
21:35:11 <nsITobin> a pdf reader as it were
21:35:30 <tomman> For me I need both, sadly
21:35:48 <nsITobin> why? why does the browser need to display it
21:36:06 <nsITobin> why can't it be downloaded read discarded or download read filled out and submitted
21:36:09 <nsITobin> simple
21:36:12 <nsITobin> effective
21:36:22 <nsITobin> doesn't require 800 js libs
21:36:23 <tomman> Because firing extra software is a waste of resources, but then... I'm talking from conceptions rooted in the Adobe Acrobat bloatfest era
21:36:53 <nsITobin> firing up a million subprocesses is a waste of resources.. wasting resources does NOT factor in unless its a power waste and it can be linked back to them
21:36:55 <tomman> if anything, pdf.js proved you don't need a security wreck of external software to render 90% of the PDFs out there
21:37:18 <nsITobin> no you need a security wreak of a browser
21:37:22 <tomman> Now, you and me are nerds and can tell which is the best tool depending on any particular scenario
21:37:23 <nsITobin> for literally everything
21:37:28 <nsITobin> no matter if you want it or not
21:37:42 <tomman> but when dealng with Other People's Computers, the less software you have to manage for them, the better
21:37:52 <nsITobin> the best tool is specific software that is designed for the purpose for which it is employed
21:38:19 <tomman> if you think PDFs on a browser is ridiculous, now try controlling a PRINTER from a webapp
21:38:28 <tomman> say, print to custom paper sizes, deal with margins and that stuff
21:38:39 <nsITobin> well then users need to stop using computers OR learn how to manage them selves effectively if not the then definition of proper
21:38:57 <tomman> as a maintainer of some internal webapp (no JS abuse, thankfully), we found long ago that browsers and printers do not mix, except via PDFs
21:39:16 <nsITobin> do you know why?
21:39:31 <nsITobin> because PDF is not a web format its a printer format
21:39:48 <nsITobin> or more properly a display technology commonly mapped to printers except if you have a mac
21:40:26 <tomman> Indeed it's a document presentation format, but once again people expect for one app to do everything
21:40:36 <tomman> and these days that app shall be Google Chr--- the web browser
21:40:55 <nsITobin> people have been misinformed or have specifically ignored the natural conclusion from experience
21:41:05 <tomman> and as someone that maintains software for the government, sadly we cant tell them to set their printers ablaze (as much as I want!)
21:41:24 <nsITobin> i think most do it to conform.. you don't want to stand out or look dumb trying to ask a question about something most don't use
21:41:33 <tomman> just yesterday I charged $20 for one of those offices to unfuck their HP MFP 135W on one of their W10 workstations :P
21:41:34 <nsITobin> conformity does not work
21:41:37 <nsITobin> see Pale Moon
21:41:52 <tomman> next time I get called to service an HP anything, I'll bring a baseball bat
21:42:18 <nsITobin> I miss my HP Deskjet 720c
21:42:27 <nsITobin> it was a decent ink jet printer
21:42:39 <nsITobin> basically an hp eq to the mid-teir bubblejet
22:59:05 <nsITobin> frg_Away: Moonchild backported 3 security patches how many are in seamonkey this round cause you have all three he applied to UXP
22:59:49 <frg_Away> nsITobin 2 not sure #3 was from mozilla
23:00:07 <frg_Away> üpickec the esr115 ones for 2.53.20
23:01:12 <nsITobin> well he doesn't properly attribute security patches to keep dem hackers away from all couple thousand Pale Moon users give or take Brazil
23:18:14 <nsITobin> ok the third seeming sec patch looks like adhoc development to match current mozilla code .. tho i can't seem to annotate or git blame to find the change it is blocked by the clang reformat
23:23:04 <frg_Away> Usually you can show the last commit before the reformat
23:37:03 <nsITobin> yeah i'd have to go before that commit in the tree and then try and view history that way but its blocking git blame
23:37:32 <nsITobin> maybe you will reconize the change
23:37:33 <nsITobin> https://repo.palemoon.org/MoonchildProductions/UXP/commit/ee865dd269b373ea2f17b5b0ac0eebaafff222b6
23:37:48 <nsITobin> i do know it is before the inital commit on the seamonkey git
23:42:58 <frg_Away> https://hg.mozilla.org/releases/mozilla-esr128/rev/64544b16dbbbe44147534a836831e234469df97a
23:44:04 <frg_Away> not sure it is this one but recent
23:45:41 <frg_Away> Only use of npon token and not in 115
23:47:05 <frg_Away> ^npn token
23:53:04 <nsITobin> yeah that's the change added after the thing gets assigned to rv
23:53:15 <nsITobin> anyway not important rest well frg