01:11:44 <CaptainTobin> wooo
01:12:23 <CaptainTobin> sm-rel is building in my fc38 chroot dunno if it will succeed but
11:47:38 <frg_Away> CoordinatorTobin Bug 1388340-57a1.patch is already in 2.53. Was also checked in into the master branch. But might need some later backports for 3.12 3.11
12:30:49 <CoordinatorTobin> 3.11 in fc38 chroot.. is dandy
12:31:51 <CoordinatorTobin> but yeah I agree, seems more backports need done for 3.11 on fc39 or just 3.12 support needs added properly but even mozilla hasn't done it yet
12:32:42 <CoordinatorTobin> which is why fedora 39 has 3.11 at all but only enough for firefox/thunderbird
12:33:33 <CoordinatorTobin> i dunno what voodoo buc is using but from git built out of rpmbuild it just won't work enough for it to create the virtualenv that HAS six in it
12:33:51 <CoordinatorTobin> that is my issue
12:34:20 <CoordinatorTobin> and while true is is more fedora than you .. fedora caring anytime soon is not something i can bet on.. not for me anyway
12:36:35 <CoordinatorTobin> atm i need six for it to create a virtualenv to provide six
12:36:45 <CoordinatorTobin> and i don't have it
12:37:22 <CoordinatorTobin> and it isn't using the one in-tree before virtualenv is established
12:37:31 <CoordinatorTobin> frg_Away:
12:46:20 <frg_Away> I onle konw that Myckel is working on more backports. My wip branch has already about 60 more.
12:56:46 <CoordinatorTobin> I'd be happy to test em, for now I got that chroot going and with being able to build cental on 39 i should be fairly good
12:58:38 <CoordinatorTobin> frg_Away: this is not a NEW situation for me but it is one I hoped not to have to encounter again, so I am all for making this the last time I have to build an active codebase using an older host than i run
13:00:34 <frg_Away> They seem to turn python 3 into an everchanging desaster so this happens. 2 was stable. Not happy about it either.
13:00:54 <CoordinatorTobin> python is a service
13:01:00 <CoordinatorTobin> all i can figure
13:02:40 <CoordinatorTobin> 2.7 was stable.. but didn't this crap happen in 2.6 and earlier 2x series as well
13:03:31 <CoordinatorTobin> i dunno if it was me I'd go back to ac configure for everything and use tauthon for mozbuild.. or replace it all with cmake
13:04:11 <CoordinatorTobin> or if I am feeling really spiteful.. a PHP driven build system.
13:05:12 <CoordinatorTobin> know what i bet mozilla will do?
13:05:44 <CoordinatorTobin> rebuild mozbuild in rust then use a much simpler build system to build rust mozbuild
13:06:39 <CoordinatorTobin> frg_Away: dare me to suggest it to them?
13:08:38 <frg_Away> rust is just as bad with every minor version bringing more fun. Not even able to build for pre macOS 10.15 now with latest one. I rather take good old makefiles or cmake which I don't exactly like either.
13:09:26 <CoordinatorTobin> frg_Away: php build system it is lol
13:39:16 <WG9s> autoconf 2.13
13:44:19 <CoordinatorTobin> autohell
13:44:25 <CoordinatorTobin> WG9s: good morning
13:47:08 <CoordinatorTobin> so if you didn't read the logbot my fc38 chroot worked fine.. my issue seems to be soley that fedora is on 3.12 and the 3.11 version only has enough to build cental and release and something is missing in sm's build system which is resulting in needing six to create the virtualenv that provides six
13:47:44 <CoordinatorTobin> and i don't have six for 3.11
13:47:48 <CoordinatorTobin> and 3.12 is busted
13:47:56 <CoordinatorTobin> for sm git
13:49:06 <CoordinatorTobin> central apperently doesn't need six to provide the virtualenv with six in it
13:49:47 <CoordinatorTobin> that is all i have come up with but for the meantime the chroot means i can build both sm git and mozilla-current .. and uxp if i care
13:50:23 <CoordinatorTobin> SO NOW if I fail to do shit.. i have NO EXCUSE
13:50:25 <CoordinatorTobin> lol
13:50:26 <CoordinatorTobin> frg_Away:
13:52:50 <CoordinatorTobin> NOW I am gonna add the mxp (multi-purpose experimental platform) patches on central code and build me a non-working suite for enjoyment reasons
13:53:32 <CoordinatorTobin> I wanna see if I get a main window at all
13:54:03 <CoordinatorTobin> since I unblocked ./mach run so anything built from comm will pass the checks
13:54:18 <CoordinatorTobin> rather than just firefox android and thunderbird
13:54:35 <CoordinatorTobin> i would be happy to get a crash
13:54:37 <CoordinatorTobin> even
13:54:45 <CoordinatorTobin> i just wanna see what happens
15:06:10 <WG9s> CoordinatorTobin: are you familiar with the TV show Monk?
16:32:02 <CoordinatorTobin> i vaugely recall it WG9s
17:46:19 <therube> > We have to abandon the concept of a web browser as in the Netscape Navigator style of web browser heresy.
17:47:29 <therube> heresy. (should have been on a separate line ;-))
18:25:11 <CoordinatorTobin> I didn't say we should elminate it
18:26:11 <CoordinatorTobin> just stop trying to make a document navigator more than a document navigator and pwa everything that is obviously trying to be a webapp because at this point.. standard browser UI for webapps is becoming a useability consern
18:26:36 <CoordinatorTobin> where the back button breaks shit
18:26:56 <CoordinatorTobin> and the address bar is pointless
18:27:01 <CoordinatorTobin> and so are cookie controls
18:27:05 <CoordinatorTobin> and etc
18:27:13 <CoordinatorTobin> still have em but not be focused on em
18:28:03 <CoordinatorTobin> the ONE thing tho that is required for any successful webapp runner would be to have content blocking and defacto standard privacy feature capabilities
18:28:51 <CoordinatorTobin> beyond that do the masses even NEED a Netscape style browser at this point for much?
18:29:13 <CoordinatorTobin> we do cause we are crazies obsessed with a big fuckin N even tho that ain't our logo
18:31:23 <CoordinatorTobin> I believe pushing pwa and arbitrary site specific browsing but with a free navigation feature (and a bonus program launcher as well) would actually allow the general web browser to become more netscape like again.
18:32:20 <CoordinatorTobin> because browsing the openweb is a different experence and has different expectations than navigating the world wide web
18:32:24 <CoordinatorTobin> imo anyway
18:33:08 <CoordinatorTobin> and I am gonna write one that does exactly that
18:33:13 <CoordinatorTobin> on modern mozilla
18:33:39 <CoordinatorTobin> and i may throw waterfox's pseudo-extensions in as well
18:35:45 <CoordinatorTobin> Cause a PWA/SSB/Program and Applet launcher would be just what I think is needed. Granted a launcher window isn't so needed when operating systems support shortcuts and desktop files but consider linux on arm as well. But the launcher window also doubles as the management as well
18:36:50 <CoordinatorTobin> I think I could ... re-jigger xulrunner and mozilla prism into the modern day and have it be a program manager/arm device launcher to boot
18:37:43 <CoordinatorTobin> conceptually
18:39:09 <CoordinatorTobin> therube WG9s whatcha think?
18:41:30 <therube> oh, so this is a "pwa", https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_web_app
18:42:12 <therube> i too old school & don't like that at all.
18:44:18 <therube> take a NAS (synology).  it's "interface" is basically a web browser.  & i feel it is horrid. i'd much rather have individual, well thought out programs to control the various aspects of the NAS, & not try to shoehorn everything into (essentially) a web browser interface.
18:46:24 <therube> & yes we have a pwa today, but it's name is Chrome, & controlled by... Chrome.  no one else has a say.
18:47:36 <CoordinatorTobin> PWA is just a silly spec that defines how to advertise webapp features
18:47:48 <CoordinatorTobin> we have had this concept since the mid-2000s
18:47:54 <CoordinatorTobin> it ain't new not really
18:47:57 <CoordinatorTobin> none of this is
18:48:02 <CoordinatorTobin> absolutely nothing is new
18:48:32 <CoordinatorTobin> except my unique brand of "kitbashing" failed past concepts into something cool and could work if i just fuckin actually did it
18:48:37 <CoordinatorTobin> you know therube
18:49:21 <CoordinatorTobin> customelements it's just really hard to use xbl
18:49:46 <CoordinatorTobin> html is effectively xhtml except no one wants to be strict about it
18:49:55 <CoordinatorTobin> and have no xml features
18:50:41 <WG9s> CaptainTobin: Sorry was ag dentist.  REason I asked was we have been looking for more contirbutors and you said you might be doing more now.  so Was going to say "it's a blssing ... and a curse" and ws not sure you would get the refernce hence the joke.
18:50:51 <CoordinatorTobin> I'd add pwa features to seamonkey but webcompat takes priority and kinda negates it
18:51:09 <CoordinatorTobin> WG9s: ha
18:51:22 <CoordinatorTobin> I am gonna contribute anywhere I can because.. i can.
18:51:40 <CoordinatorTobin> and more than that.. i should.
18:52:52 <CoordinatorTobin> I should have been a SeaMonkey contributor all along regardless of whatelse I did..
18:58:11 <CoordinatorTobin> I've done my Navigator which is SeaMonkey code, I have done Interlink which is Thunderbird code and I done Firefox code.. I have done build system and ux stuff as well as from scratch infrastructure to support it .. and I have a half-made never before existing example app on modern mozilla a feat I a few years ago dismissed as having any point or potental.
18:58:39 <CoordinatorTobin> So why not contribute and create.
18:59:17 <WG9s> well oddly back in the day, when i first started working on it still called firebird and thunderbird the mozilla fols thoiught the suite was the premier project and thought we were the maveriks.  now firefox is eally the only product they care about.
18:59:19 <CoordinatorTobin> Also a modern mozilla pwa runner COULD take over the "second browser" spot many have to maintain
18:59:31 <CoordinatorTobin> lessening the webcompat burdon on projects LIKE seamonkey
19:00:09 <CoordinatorTobin> WG9s: Except.. Thunderbird.
19:00:29 <WG9s> if you go back in the old cvs stuff there is a manit camnit damnit checkin form ben goodger in firebird.  and i am the only other one who knows the story behind that.
19:00:52 <CoordinatorTobin> and the fact thunderbird is the exception and still consigned to comm means.. at this point.. they are BEGGING for someone else to validate their tech
19:01:38 <WG9s> i was just starting to folow the project had no real idea how to actually submit a patch and he landed somthing that broke save page as.  so i crated a ptach but not knowing what to do on bugzilla emailed it to him.
19:02:34 <CoordinatorTobin> I'll do the whole old school bug rigamarol but preferably I'd like to just hand the patches to you guys and have you do the thing.
19:02:36 <WG9s> so next day he ordered a new system i think from dell and decided to do a save as before pt=nting the order confirmation and invoce and the broser crashed
19:03:04 <WG9s> next thing he did was read his email and first messge there was the one from me with the fix
19:03:28 <CoordinatorTobin> I am pretty sure thunderbird is sticking to proceedure and that is all phabricated
19:03:39 <CoordinatorTobin> lol
19:04:08 <WG9s> so that is what pompted the Damnit! Damnit! Daminit! cehck-in comment had he reaed hs eamil before buying the new system ...
19:04:22 <CoordinatorTobin> that's great
19:04:52 <CoordinatorTobin> I wish I had went for being a mozilla contributor back in those days
19:05:13 <WG9s> his patch rthat boke it was only missing a null check
19:05:22 <WG9s> not a complicated fix
19:05:24 <CoordinatorTobin> typical
19:05:29 <CoordinatorTobin> even today
19:05:32 <CoordinatorTobin> .. fuckin typical
19:06:06 <CoordinatorTobin> i wonder if the tree is like half nullchecks by now
19:06:19 <CoordinatorTobin> on uxp we constantly had to add them to various crap as stuff changed
19:06:24 <WG9s> but if i was not so new to the project that i could have posted onthe bug he might have noticed sooner.
19:06:59 <WG9s> and if he had read the email before he bought the computer
19:09:15 <CoordinatorTobin> jcranmer is attempting to restore a full from cvs coniguous development history for thunderbird
19:09:33 <CoordinatorTobin> likely all of mozilla
19:09:43 <CoordinatorTobin> contiguous
19:09:47 <CoordinatorTobin> ... unbroken
19:11:34 <WG9s> last i knew that checkin of the null check with the comment is still there but i do not still have the reply email form him whidch makes the story more complete.
19:12:52 <WG9s> Ben was pissed becaue it was his oen patch that cause the browser crash and also had he read his emial first he could have avoided the crash
19:14:18 <WG9s> I was so new to this that I had no clue that he was chief engineer on the project
19:19:16 <CoordinatorTobin> ok.. suite central build kicked off with MXP patches
19:19:22 <CoordinatorTobin> which applied cleanly to central
19:19:25 <CoordinatorTobin> which was nice
19:20:18 <CoordinatorTobin> WG9s: what an incredible story dude
19:20:59 <CoordinatorTobin> btw I think --disable-mailnews should be able to work and seamonkey needs a built in splash screen
19:21:22 <CoordinatorTobin> check the mozirc logs that was what I was on about
19:21:31 <CoordinatorTobin> when I first started hanging around here
19:26:12 <CoordinatorTobin> yeah this currently applies cleanly to central https://github.com/binaryoutcast/mxp-predev/compare/af70bde0f89534997314e69c08b82b2c2eda9644...ea4ef51efd611971c015af3ad0f48125893e2f52.patch
19:28:00 <CoordinatorTobin> at.. compile error
19:28:09 <CoordinatorTobin> in nsSuiteModule
19:30:40 <CoordinatorTobin> ah yeah
19:30:54 <CoordinatorTobin> I am gonna have to apply these patches
19:34:33 <CoordinatorTobin> or one of em
20:09:01 <CaptainTobin> mattatobin⊙nbc LINUX /binoc/workstation/projects/gecko
20:09:01 <CaptainTobin> $ python3.11 ./mach run --chrome about:config
20:09:01 <CaptainTobin>  0:00.48 /binoc/workstation/projects/.obj/suite-x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/dist/bin/seamonkey --chrome about:config -no-remote -profile /binoc/workstation/projects/.obj/suite-x86_64-pc-linux-gnu/tmp/profile-default
20:09:01 <CaptainTobin> [ImapModuleLoader] Using nsImapService.cpp
20:09:01 <CaptainTobin> ATTENTION: default value of option mesa_glthread overridden by environment.
20:09:03 <CaptainTobin> JavaScript error: resource://devtools/client/performance-new/popup/menu-button.sys.mjs, line 15: Error: Failed to load resource:///modules/CustomizableUI.sys.mjs
20:09:06 <CaptainTobin> console.error: (new TypeError("NetworkError: Network request failed", "resource://services-settings/Utils.sys.mjs", 236))
20:09:09 <CaptainTobin> welp
20:09:14 <CaptainTobin> guess I need more patches than just the one
20:09:31 <CaptainTobin> frg_Away WG9s
20:11:36 <frg_Away> This already occurs in 2.53 and is a non issue there. I wanted to fix it for ages. We donÄt have CustomizableUI:
20:11:37 <frg_Away> Timestamp: 16.02.2024, 21:07:05
20:11:39 <frg_Away> Error: NS_ERROR_FILE_NOT_FOUND:
20:11:40 <frg_Away> Source File: jar:file:///C:/Program%20Files/SeaMonkey/omni.ja!/components/devtools-startup.js
20:11:42 <frg_Away> Line: 344
20:12:11 <frg_Away> the devtools menu in suite needs to be fixed too.
20:12:25 <CaptainTobin> yeah those are worthless outputs
20:12:59 <CaptainTobin> ok then.. revert and apply all the patches see what that gets me
20:13:15 <CaptainTobin> frg_Away: how did you bypass the ./mach run restriction in your testing of central
20:13:31 <CaptainTobin> or did you just run it manually
20:14:12 <frg_Away> I don't :) suite tests are broken anyway and if I test I build TB or Firefox. Fixing tests need a dedicated developer and will probably never happen.
20:14:41 <CaptainTobin> I want a main window and I shall HAVE a main window.
20:14:48 <CaptainTobin> idc if it works
20:14:53 <CaptainTobin> i want it to display something
20:14:55 <CaptainTobin> frg_Away:
20:15:30 <frg_Away> you need to remove overlays first. init is alos broken.
20:15:38 <CaptainTobin> do I?
20:15:47 <CaptainTobin> lol
20:15:56 <frg_Away> I suspect yes
20:16:06 <CaptainTobin> https://github.com/binaryoutcast/mxp-example-app/blob/TRUNK/example/modules/Overlays.sys.mjs
20:16:11 <CaptainTobin> that may indicate otherwise
20:16:14 <CaptainTobin> ;)
20:16:38 <CaptainTobin> one of the tidbits nicked from waterfox
20:16:53 <CaptainTobin> i think they stole it from thunderbird
20:16:54 <CaptainTobin> tho
20:16:57 <CaptainTobin> have to check to see
20:18:36 <CaptainTobin> but yeah gonna apply the rest of these patches and see what happens
20:18:37 <frg_Away> yes might work this way. Bug 1452448 tracks early stuff till I gave up.
20:19:25 <frg_Away> Unfixed items from here need to be added too Bug 1433370
20:20:09 <CaptainTobin> also not related but because moz.configure wasn't complex enough https://github.com/binaryoutcast/mxp-example-app/blob/TRUNK/example/moz.configure
20:20:55 <CaptainTobin> the whole mInitDllBlocklistOOP thing does require a change to mozilla-central
20:21:09 <CaptainTobin> for seamonkey's xre to run unless you already added that
20:23:08 <CaptainTobin> support
20:38:05 <njsg> CaptainTobin: for where six missing is still a problem, well it probably won't matter if the issue is with a vendored copy in the build directory... but do you have also the six package installed? I only saw the pip one mentioned in the backlog, but not the six one?
20:39:01 <CoordinatorTobin> fedora 38 with python 2.11 build fine
20:39:13 <CoordinatorTobin> and yes i have six installed but can't install it for 3.11
20:39:24 <CoordinatorTobin> on fc39
20:40:06 <CoordinatorTobin> so i have no way to have six be available long enough to create the virtualenv that provides six to the buildsystem
20:40:44 <CoordinatorTobin> buc may know more
20:40:50 <CoordinatorTobin> but i can't talk to him
20:42:11 <CoordinatorTobin> for now I am using an fc38 chroot
20:42:13 <CoordinatorTobin> njsg:
20:42:20 <CoordinatorTobin> for 2.53
20:42:51 <CoordinatorTobin> i can build 2.121a1 just fine LOL
20:42:59 <CoordinatorTobin> on fc39
20:43:16 <njsg> ah, so it's only built for a single version of python3 at a time? sounds so from the changelog https://packages.fedoraproject.org/pkgs/python-six/python3-six/fedora-39.html
20:43:46 <CoordinatorTobin> yeah and firefox doesn't require it to setup the virtualenv so it isn't shipped properly it seems
20:43:58 <CoordinatorTobin> cause 3.11 is in 39 JUST for firefox and thunderbird
20:44:44 <CoordinatorTobin> but buc somehow is still producing an rpm
20:44:51 <CoordinatorTobin> so.. no idea for sure
20:46:12 <CoordinatorTobin> njsg: remember fedora means rolling release as a social service
20:50:23 <CoordinatorTobin> I can tell you this.. if fedora's misguided release stratgy is gonna impact my ability to dev mozcode i am gonna have a few things to say
20:59:59 <njsg> CoordinatorTobin: what's fun is that for many packages Gentoo will give you more than that :-D
21:00:19 <njsg> I mean, it's frequent that more than one version of python is supported, in some cases that does mean installing for both at the same time
21:00:50 <CoordinatorTobin> yeah but fedora is only ever gonna support latest regardless if older exists
21:01:09 <CoordinatorTobin> I need to get switched to el
21:01:14 <CoordinatorTobin> or get my lfs going
21:04:29 <CoordinatorTobin> Will SeaMonkey 3.0 come out?
21:04:40 <CoordinatorTobin> njsg frg_Away WG9s lol
21:05:48 <WG9s> CoordinatorTobin: do you remeber shat changed to make it version 2 rather than version 1/
21:05:52 <frg_Away> We will call it SeaMonkey 2030.1
21:06:20 <CoordinatorTobin> WG9s: XPFE to Toolkit is why it was made 2.0
21:06:43 <CoordinatorTobin> if it goes from XUL to XHTML that would warrent a 3
21:06:46 <WG9s> noit was source code repository changed form cvs to mercurial
21:06:46 <CoordinatorTobin> i think
21:07:01 <CoordinatorTobin> uhh was it?
21:07:32 <CoordinatorTobin> the repo change happened around the same time xpfe and xpinstall were stripped down to barely anything
21:07:56 <CoordinatorTobin> but 2.0 was totally because of the tech change from xpfe (nearly) to toolkit
21:08:50 <CoordinatorTobin> https://www.seamonkey-project.org/releases/seamonkey2.0/
21:10:43 <CoordinatorTobin> frg_Away: I strongly suggest you don't do that cause the version is so damned high you can't change it later without busting aus
21:10:48 <CoordinatorTobin> and profile checks
21:10:50 <CoordinatorTobin> and shit
21:11:25 <CoordinatorTobin> but.. a 3.YYYY.PATCH might be a good version scheme if esr bound
21:11:56 <frg_Away> I/we don't plan too :)  In any case we now have a display version which is different from the actual one. We could call it SeaMonkey 2.Donaldduck. Same for the installer package name
21:12:37 <CoordinatorTobin> heh
21:13:02 <CoordinatorTobin> Version display is annoying when you have an add-ons system dependant on version numbers
21:13:11 <njsg> SeaMonkey 2030.1 will be y3k-compliant, but will it be y10k-complaint?
21:13:32 <frg_Away> Internally it is not used. Just in the frontend code.
21:13:45 <CoordinatorTobin> yeah
21:14:05 <CoordinatorTobin> but the issue is it doesn't match the internal version so minVersion would be wrong
21:14:20 <CoordinatorTobin> if someone typed the display version in
21:17:59 <WG9s> CoordinatorTobin: i seem to recall the version for changing the major version had to do with loss of change hisroty with the change in version control system.
21:20:05 <CoordinatorTobin> maybe but i was told it was largely because of the massive xpfe to toolkit transition
21:20:30 <CoordinatorTobin> likely was ratty
21:20:35 <CoordinatorTobin> i miss ratty
21:22:54 <CoordinatorTobin> You know, as Thunderbird's UX changes I kinda like the direction it is going tho the new ux stuff is badly clashing with the older ux stuff and they kinda have that spaces left toolbar half controlling tabs
21:23:59 <CoordinatorTobin> Not that I don't like the traditional UI and layout hell I made Interlink's more like Borealis which means more like SeaMonkey MailNews
21:24:41 <CoordinatorTobin> I just kinda think for them it could work really well and they do seem to be approching it with a lot more care than just skinning on australis style like what I removed from Interlink
21:24:44 <CoordinatorTobin> WG9s:
21:26:11 <CoordinatorTobin> but yeah why not poke at it some
21:26:23 <CoordinatorTobin> it could be beneficial to my learning
21:26:52 <CoordinatorTobin> also fun
21:28:02 <CoordinatorTobin> seamonkey-central.. damned right
21:28:05 <CoordinatorTobin> lol
21:38:52 <CoordinatorTobin> there c-c patches applied
21:38:56 <CoordinatorTobin> clobberbuild
21:39:29 <CoordinatorTobin> Good thing about the linux is I can do part of the work from my craptop
21:41:27 <njsg> craptop, not a hp consumer laptop, then? (those would be "lapburners")
21:42:06 <CoordinatorTobin> hp elitebook orginally 2014 refarbed in .. well later 2010s
21:42:31 <CoordinatorTobin> oh it gets warm and i run a second monitor off it
21:42:39 <CoordinatorTobin> i abuse the HELL out of this machine
21:43:04 <CoordinatorTobin> can barely play 1080p video and 2k is rather out of the question unless vlc and i never ever ever seek
21:43:05 <CoordinatorTobin> lol
21:43:30 <CoordinatorTobin> i also tell it to do it over smb from linux
21:43:42 <CoordinatorTobin> so yeah i make my tech work for a living
21:45:17 <CoordinatorTobin> so frg_Away does comm mean communicator or community to you personally?
21:47:14 <frg_Away> Beats me. Nowadays it would be more community but when it was split maybe communicator. In any case not much community left also.
21:47:49 <CoordinatorTobin> I want it to mean community
21:49:10 <guest_> why is the Let's Encrypt certificate for ircbot.comm-central.org not updated since Feb 10 - the idea behind the 3 month lifetime of the Let's Encrypt certificate is that the certificate is/can automatically renewed and therefore should never be invalid
21:49:45 <CoordinatorTobin> wow
21:50:50 <CoordinatorTobin> WELL.. maybe someone needs to kick the cron job if automatically renewed or needs to manually renew it cause that is a totally valid option and I do it cause I run my own dns server and have multiple servers
21:50:58 <CoordinatorTobin> mister guest_
21:52:05 <CoordinatorTobin> But I betcha if you ask a bit nicer to someone actually apart of this project they will look into it ;)
21:53:22 <CoordinatorTobin> Errors happen, oversights are made, fix it.. or deal with it is my emerging motto
21:53:47 <guest_> these words from you LOL
21:54:13 <CoordinatorTobin> Yes those words from me, so take note of the judgement made.
21:54:14 <guest_> it has mentioned a few days ago that the cert had been expired  but no activity so far
21:54:25 <guest_> ROFL
21:54:49 <CoordinatorTobin> y0 frg_Away WG9s the cc logbot domain has an invalid cert. May wanna fix it soonish.
21:56:02 <guest_> Feb 11 - https://ircbot.comm-central.org:8080/seamonkey/20240211#c223359
21:56:06 <frg_Away> still not our bot. need to wait
21:56:23 <MattATobin> ah
21:56:27 <MattATobin> who is running it?
21:56:39 <MattATobin> it isn't glob
21:56:50 <guest_> https://ircbot.comm-central.org:8080/seamonkey/20240211#c223360
21:57:08 <MattATobin> guest_: seems like it isn't much of an issue for you specifically ;)
21:58:13 <MattATobin> I miss TheBot
21:58:27 <guest_> fry_Away - are the any plans to remove description field from bookmarks dialog and places.sqlite or do you your best t keep the description field ?
21:58:28 <MattATobin> he always knew the score
21:58:49 <njsg> I know my brain needs a defrag when I open that link, in the context of this topic, and I still get surprised by the expired certificate message :-P
21:59:12 <MattATobin> who is running it?
21:59:41 <guest_> just need to add an exception to except the expired cert  - I'm more suprised about the problem with the automated process of renewal process for Let's Encrypt certs
21:59:47 <MattATobin> and why does it need to be https?
21:59:58 <MattATobin> it's a public log of a public channel
22:00:25 <MattATobin> guest_: there are like half a dozen methods to renew and issue le certs now
22:00:37 <MattATobin> it isn't just nginx/apache and certbot
22:01:03 <guest_> MattATobin - from above link I guess WG9s the SM Build Master
22:01:45 <MattATobin> I do DNS verification and one day I will write the crap to automate it.. for now I just suck at keeping it up lol but once BinOC stuff is using it I am sure I will be more on it
22:02:08 <MattATobin> guest_: why are you asking me?
22:02:26 <MattATobin> Just cause I know everything doesn't mean I know a specific thing that minute lol
22:03:15 <guest_> some browsers would complain or Father Search does lower the ranking if not https - hmm who cares about it ?
22:03:42 <MattATobin> guest_: yeah but so far Mozilla browsers are all about connect at all costs
22:03:58 <MattATobin> so it remains fairly easy to just accept and get through
22:04:49 <MattATobin> I wouldn't even use HTTPS if I hadn't bought a five year cert anticipating a lot of BinOC/UXP innovation beyond the children of the moon
22:04:57 <guest_> yeah - but bad practice to accept invalid cert
22:05:13 <njsg> Father Search has spent so much effort promoting scam sites and smartphone-ready scrappers and contentless sites that it doesn't really matter much anymore
22:05:31 <MattATobin> well just don't download any software from an invalid cert domain and have a content blocker and you'll be fine
22:05:32 <guest_> Thumps up
22:05:39 <MattATobin> also obviously personal info
22:05:42 <MattATobin> yadda yadda
22:06:17 <MattATobin> https everywhere negates https
22:06:35 <MattATobin> for anything lower than EV
22:06:35 <njsg> me I'd like if grandfather metasearch were still available in the form of a usable webcrawler with a js-less interface, and also good results
22:06:51 <MattATobin> I miss webcrawler
22:06:52 <guest_> MattATobin you're wrong - a lot of bad actions are possible even without downloading or content blocking
22:06:58 <MattATobin> and xoom
22:07:21 <njsg> last I checked webcrawler turned into a thing that relies on js even for pagination, if it's even still available, I gave up once it became unusable without js...
22:07:54 <njsg> well, I also miss the search results sidebar!
22:07:56 <guest_> js-less interface - do you mean WASM based UI ?
22:08:24 <MattATobin> look this is all heading to node codegenning to rust
22:08:28 <MattATobin> over the web
22:08:40 <MattATobin> lol
22:08:42 <njsg> guest_: no, I mean the non-Ycombinator-news understanding of "js-less" :-P
22:09:16 <MattATobin> so guest_ you obviously have been within lunar orbit.. who are you lol
22:10:47 <MattATobin> build is taking a minute
22:11:17 <MattATobin> btw I attempted a disabled unified compilation with pgo
22:11:22 <MattATobin> on firefox
22:11:25 <MattATobin> the other day
22:11:55 <MattATobin> it failed on profiling cause i was in a screen session and didn;t restart it.. already an 80 min build wasted lol
22:12:19 <MattATobin> oh it's done.. 33 minutes at -j6 nice
22:12:28 <MattATobin> now I have to get up to run it
22:18:06 <MattATobin> ok I am gonna do a de-optimized and debug build find out what is happening cause I am getting nothing from the console of consiquence
22:23:38 <MattATobin> need to setup a znc server.. there are too many Tobins running around
22:24:34 <frg_Away> guest_ no plany to follow Firefox here. As long as it is based on our code I/we will try to keep this. I don't need it but there is no need to remove it and it serves a purpose from some.
22:24:49 <MattATobin> he left
22:27:37 <njsg> well, guest_ is aware of the logbot :-)
22:27:41 <frg_Away> I think hrosik but I always forget the real name :)
22:28:08 <MattATobin> well they know who I am so..
22:29:46 <MattATobin> frg_Away: so you think it is likely suite glue making it not spawn a main window at all
22:30:24 <MattATobin> OH
22:30:26 <MattATobin> OH
22:30:59 <frg_Away> It was some time ago I looked. The init code needs to be redone and then some more.
22:31:02 <MattATobin> I wonder if it is because seamonkey relies on appshell to always in last ditch case default to chrome://navigator/content/navigator.xul
22:31:06 <MattATobin> cause it don't do that no more
22:31:15 <MattATobin> the fallback was killed
22:31:39 <MattATobin> firefox and thunderbird spawn their main windows from their glue component
22:31:49 <frg_Away> Also all e10s now.
22:31:55 <MattATobin> my example app uses a toolkit pref in the command line handler
22:33:02 <MattATobin> well I will know more once this debug build is done i can at least get the debug messages
22:34:37 <MattATobin> btw frg_Away who are the canonical members of the seamonkey project and what is the group called or is it still SeaMonkey Council?
22:35:06 <frg_Away> still the council. mcsmurf IanN and a few others.
22:36:31 <MattATobin> and seamonkey is a legal entity now .. do you own the trademark or does mozilla license it?
22:40:24 <frg_Away> SeaMonkey e.V. own the trademark
22:40:32 <MattATobin> ah good
22:41:24 <frg_Away> I swtiched over everything I found to the e.V. in suite. If there are other references need to deal with them too.
22:43:17 <MattATobin> https://xr.thereisonlyxul.org/seamonkey-2.53/source/xpfe/appshell/nsXULWindow.cpp#1949
22:43:25 <MattATobin> that does not exist in m-c appshell
22:43:28 <MattATobin> anymore
22:45:31 <MattATobin> urlStr.AssignLiteral(BROWSER_CHROME_URL_QUOTED);
22:46:04 <MattATobin> that is how Firefox is doing it
22:46:17 <MattATobin> it was glue i THOUGHT
22:46:19 <MattATobin> but i dunno
22:46:43 <MattATobin> maybe it was JUST thunderbird who used glue to spawn the main window
22:58:57 <frg_Away> No but there wre tons of missing bugs. You probably need to go thru TBs history for base and components and then some.
23:02:51 <MattATobin> I been referencing thunderbird's history but i need to get it up on github so i can search through it properly
23:03:35 <frg_Away> I still recoomend TortoiseHg. Much superior.
23:03:43 <MattATobin> Linux
23:03:52 <frg_Away> available
23:06:11 <MattATobin> I would approch it like this.. get a main window.. then ifdef off mailnews and composer so can deal with em later.. rig up that overlays esm and make navigator do something and go from there
23:07:24 <MattATobin> and I am totally 100% not gonna attempt that very soon.. nope deff not at all.
23:09:34 <frg_Away> TortoiseHg Linux: https://ibb.co/DRmRwKr
23:09:36 <frg_Away> Yes I know kde Windows  7 theme :)
23:10:08 <MattATobin> i just need to write one
23:10:16 <MattATobin> i always wanted to do a xul based git client
23:11:09 <frg_Away> Tortoisesvn and Tortoisegit are much inferior to the hg version under Windows fwiw.
23:59:36 <CaptainTobin> WG9s: that confvar specifing default browser chrome url isn't working for some reason
23:59:53 <CaptainTobin> but I did get a main window when I used the toolkit.defaultChromeURL pref