01:31:26 <IsambardPrince> Good.
04:22:07 <GrannyGoose> i always thought Matrix was pisspoor which is why i never used it
04:45:15 <IsambardPrince> It looks like you're trying to add another point of failure to your workflow! Want some help?
04:45:17 <IsambardPrince> B-)
04:47:19 <IsambardPrince> It looks like you're trying to develop SeaMonkey from a 600 MB browser tab app that SeaMonkey cannot load! Want some help?
04:47:55 <IsambardPrince> So much for dogfooding.
04:48:41 <IsambardPrince> Oh well, at least the SeaMonkey developers haven't gone into hiding under GULAG GROUPS and slammed the door shut behind them and moved to GitHub, yet, I think. ;)
07:29:06 <GrannyGoose> who owns the Seamonkey Domain?
07:31:52 <ewong> SeaMonkey e.V.
07:31:56 <ewong> fwiw
07:39:09 <GrannyGoose> ok thanks ewong
07:39:41 <GrannyGoose> i'll brb in 10 min
07:52:51 <IsambardPrince> Is the next release of SeaMonkey going to support ffmpeg 6?
07:52:57 <IsambardPrince> Or what is it actually using?
07:53:13 <IsambardPrince> For some reason, it stopped playing MPEG-4 the same time Firefox ESR 102 did.
07:53:37 <GrannyGoose> .17 supports ffmpeg6?
07:55:06 <GrannyGoose> least Buc says so in here https://koji.fedoraproject.org/koji/buildinfo?buildID=2267028
07:57:54 <IsambardPrince> I'm on .16 because Fedora package.
07:58:08 <IsambardPrince> Also, will someone PLEASE KILL TLS 1.0 and 1.1. Thank you. :)
07:58:31 <IsambardPrince> "Will someone please get rid of the 10,000 year old dead plants?"
08:03:16 <njsg> Do you really need it to be removed from the package and not just disabled?
08:04:06 <njsg> or is it enabled in the build you're using?
08:04:07 <frg_Away> lsambardprince Was too late for 2.53.17. Will see that I get it into .28. Should be ok fro Fedora. TLS 1.0 and 1.1 are disabled by default but will stay as option for people needing it with old gear as long as nss supports it.
08:04:13 <IsambardPrince> I don't know why SeaMonkey is shipping dead TLS versions that nothing legitimate uses anymore, but have known vulnerabilities.
08:04:27 <IsambardPrince> They're on by default in the Fedora RPM.
08:05:35 <IsambardPrince> It's possible that this is an issue in the Fedora Source RPM's spec?
08:05:39 <frg_Away> I kw we switch the defaults off. There might be special hardware needing it which is unly used locally.
08:06:24 <frg_Away> buc should know. If they are not off by default I consider iit a bug.
08:07:19 <IsambardPrince> I think the only way to ensure it stays off is to make it so distributors can't possibly turn it back on in their build config and ship it that way.
08:08:37 <njsg> IsambardPrince: check if it's enabled in a new profile. Is it possible you've enabled it before and that's why you see it?
08:09:09 <njsg> I think forcing it to set back to disabled would be possible but would be annoying for people who do need it enabled
08:09:34 * njsg bbl
08:11:25 <IsambardPrince> Nope. I turned it off myself.
08:40:01 <frg_Away> lsambardPrince just check with a fresh profile and off there as expected under Windows
12:06:11 <tomman> https://www.theregister.com/2023/07/31/arc_a_radical_new_browser/ El Reg writer praises a "new" web browser - said browser is actually the 5432463th Chromium rebadge with some shiny UI tweaks. Writer gets all pissy when people reminds him that "EWW CHROMIUM"
12:06:11 <tomman> (also he STILL perpetuates on the comments the myth that Waterfox is crash city, or that Pale Moon is "OOOOOOOOOOOOLD")
14:57:23 <WG9s> seems to me if his distro altered the defaults then he needs to file a bug with the distro
14:57:44 <WG9s> compalining they changed defaults form upstream
15:02:41 <frg_Away> tomman Looks like the usual sh*t: No menu or at least not in the picture. macOs should have one and a sidebar I dislike.  I rater stick to Vivaldi if the bad day arrives and I need to switch permaently
15:44:50 <buc> IsambardPrince: Both TLS 1.0 and 1.1 are disabled by default long time ago. IOW, nothing changed here comparing to the upstream and own Fedora's policies. So pls actually check on a clean profile (ie. "mv ~/.mozilla ~/.mozilla-SAVED", then run "seamonkey").
15:45:33 <tomman> Oh, I do need to check the dissapearing search providers issue on a clean profile
15:45:39 <tomman> it still happens even on the nightlies!
15:48:14 <buc> Fedora's 2.53.17 already support ffpeg-6.0, as well as upcoming upstream webcomponents (customElelemts etc.). For other Linuxes either try https://buc.fedorapeople.org/seamonkey/download/seamonkey-2.53.17-1.tar.xz, or just enable the correspond prefs in about:config
15:48:40 <buc> (for webcomponents only, I mean :) )
16:04:33 <therube> tomman: don't know what your search provider issues were, nor if what is in SeaMonkey applies in any way to FF, but (on the FF end), http://forums.mozillazine.org/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=3111611
16:05:33 <tomman> therube: my problem (which started happening sometime during the .17 betas) is this: I have a few search providers I added years ago
16:05:58 <tomman> but for some reason, Wikipedia English keeps going away after a restart, being replaced by Yahoo Argentina
16:06:17 <tomman> I can delete Yahoo, readd Wikipedia EN, and it all works... until the next time I restart the browser
16:06:44 <tomman> funny enough, it doesn't seem to affect the other two non-standard search engines I added years ago (AniDB, VNDB) - those always stick
16:07:06 <tomman> so it's not just a case of "reverting to factory defaults", but only ONE is reverting
16:08:22 <therube> maybe a permissions issue.  check your Profile & look for incremented "search provider" files (or similar).
16:08:24 <therube> no idea where they are, but if it's named search.htm you might have search-1.htm search-2.htm search-3.htm... kind of thing
16:08:50 <therube> extension that might be interfering?
16:11:54 <tomman> Hmmm, I'm taking a look at $PROFILE/searchplugins/
16:12:13 <tomman> I can see only 3 providers listed there: AniDB, VNDB, and Wikipedia-ES, three XML files dated 2015
16:12:39 <tomman> can't see the other 3 providers I have set (Google, MercadoLibre VE, and Wikipedia EN)
16:12:44 <tomman> but neither Google nor MercadoLibre revert
16:14:15 <tomman> there is also a search.json on my profile
16:14:34 <tomman> dated back to 2016!
16:15:44 <tomman> yay, one-liner JSON
16:16:07 <tomman> this file looks suspect, I can see my providers there, but also providers I have long deleted (both stock ones and custom added ones)
16:16:40 <tomman> there is also a search.json.mozlz4, dated yesterday
16:19:34 <tomman> > "filePath" : "/opt/seamonkey/searchplugins/duckduckgo.xml"
16:19:55 <tomman> 1) I don't use DDG, and 2) there is not even a searchplugins directory on the SeaMonkey tarballs!
16:20:16 <tomman> (But that's kinda irrelevant since indeed DDG is not the one coming back)
16:20:51 <tomman> also that file (search.json) doesn't list MercadoLibre VE
16:22:54 <tomman> now I'm more puzzled - where is MercadoLibre VE provider stored? and from where is Yahoo AR coming back!?
16:23:35 <tomman> maybe it's search.json.mozlz4? Need to find something to uncompress that, but the only thing I find is some Rust tool and I refuse to install a Rust toolchain here
16:30:02 <tomman> nevermind, they have a 5MB Linux binary I can use
16:30:50 <tomman> and indeed I can now tell that stock providers are buried into omni.ja: "_loadPath" : "jar:[app]/omni.ja!/yahoo-ar.xml"
16:31:59 <tomman> all of my search providers are there, including MercadoLibre VE which has no provider XML on disk
16:33:49 <WG9s> tomman seems to love taliing to himself.
16:34:37 <tomman> wow, I'm trying to pastebin my decoded search.json.mozlz4, and it trips spam filters on Pastebin and Debian's paste!
16:34:48 <WG9s> so sixteen posts in a row with no replies
16:36:14 <WG9s> just seems more you are taling and not listening
16:37:04 <tomman> WG9s: I'm just logging my findings on trying to find some sense on this search provider issues
16:37:45 <tomman> Anyway, if anyone wants to take a look, here is my uncompressed+pretty printed search.json.mozlz4: https://0x0.st/H2Vz.pp.json
16:44:45 <WG9s> just sayin' with a different approach I might have taken this on.  not so much now!
16:45:53 <buc> tomman: According to this file, wikipedia-es shoud be in omni.ja, but you mentioned it is in your searchplugins/ subdir (without "filePath" in the json file). Try to delete wikipedia-es stuff from searpliguns/ dir first.
16:48:01 <buc> (it is possible that wikipedia-ES was chosen by the locale settings, so actually it is a global "wikipedia", tuned to your locale. This can badly corellate to your manual wikipedia-EN install).
19:14:30 <MattATobin> just so you know the matrix bridge has been down since yesterday so no one on irc can see anything here
19:17:31 <frg_Away> Maybe someone took the red pill
19:33:40 <CaptainTobin> well it came back up like just before I said it
19:33:49 <CaptainTobin> see this is why people should listen to me more
19:33:52 <CaptainTobin> I keep tellin em
19:33:54 <CaptainTobin> lol
19:34:19 <CaptainTobin> hello frg_Away
19:34:41 <CaptainTobin> so i found some more .. platform breaking flaws in g4jc early webcomponents mass patching
19:34:48 <frg_Away> CaptainTobin hi
19:34:52 <CaptainTobin> i also tracked my own releases
19:35:04 <CaptainTobin> interlink has been slightly busted since 2021
19:35:10 <CaptainTobin> all of 2021 onward
19:35:14 <CaptainTobin> through gre through are
19:35:17 <CaptainTobin> busted
19:35:24 <CaptainTobin> and I didn't notice it.
19:36:12 <CaptainTobin> what the hell HAPPENED to me in 2021 exactly
19:36:19 <CaptainTobin> cause I am not entirely sure anymore
19:37:17 <CaptainTobin> of course I assumed responsibility for quality and shit like this it was not seemingly ever given a priority and I find it disterbing
19:38:27 <CaptainTobin> well for the time being my plan is to warp my mind with 1.8.1, uxp-end-of-2020, and sm's 56 which I have em right here in front of me
19:38:50 <frg_Away> Nothing new. Occasionally IanN or I fork up a backports and notice much much later.
19:40:16 <CaptainTobin> yeah but I hold my self to a higher standard than that and typically expect it from others .. 2021 was a god damned disaster and I refuse to blame the pandemic for it and I know it wasn't all me..
19:40:36 <CaptainTobin> just a good size chunk of course
19:42:39 <frg_Away> errors happen. I still grumble when I find one I made but I am not Jesus nor Superman. I fix it and life continues.
19:57:54 <CaptainTobin> but that doesn't discount you being or becoming SuperJesus
19:57:57 <CaptainTobin> frg_Away:
19:58:00 <CaptainTobin> does it?
19:59:42 <frg_Away> CaptainTobin Naa too much responsibility. I prefer to stay a second rate programmer. Most are 3rd or 4th rate so good enough for me :)
20:01:08 <CaptainTobin> I am a graphic and web designer and former Dalek Strategist..
20:01:21 <CaptainTobin> the world is strange
20:40:22 <buc> frg: Does "media/mozva" in dom/media/platforms/ffmpeg/ffmpeg60/moz.build actually works?
20:57:50 <frg_Away> buc I think this is vpdau and needs wayland/webrender and if not a very late media stack. Not there yet by a mile under Linux.
20:57:52 <frg_Away> http://xr.binaryoutcast.com/seamonkey-2.53/source/dom/media/platforms/ffmpeg/ffmpeg59/moz.build#32
20:59:37 <buc> frg: My build faled until I commented out it. And "include ipc/chromium" as well.
21:01:07 <frg_Away> buc drat new moz.build. Just added the patch but tested only under Windows. WG9s can you delay you build a bit.
21:02:06 <frg_Away> was already the way with the 59 update. Forgot.
21:02:39 <buc> Me too. :)
21:04:43 <frg_Away> buc compared the other parts with your patch but not this one.
21:09:35 <frg_Away> Fixed but Bill needs to restart the build. 6 minutes too late.
21:57:41 <IsambardPrince> Matthew Garrett (through one of his homophobic troll accounts) made fun of me for using SeaMonkey.
21:58:01 <IsambardPrince> I mentioned that his friend Poettering got a PWNIE for LAMEST VENDOR RESPONSE EVER and then went to Microsoft.
22:00:16 <IanN_Away> IsambardPrince: that's not nice :(
22:16:33 <IsambardPrince> Neither is he, I suppose.
22:16:51 <IsambardPrince> The argument of course was "security". He claims Google Chrome is the most "secure" thing ever.
22:17:12 <IsambardPrince> And I said "it's full of spyware and you can't even fully control the web platform with ubo and noscript".
22:18:01 <IsambardPrince> I like browsing with JavaScript off. On its best day, it's temperamental and slow, and quite often it's also malicious because it's impossible for anything to support it to fix all the bugs.
22:18:41 <IsambardPrince> Google has this vision of binary pipes, encryption, and web browsers as VMs.
22:18:52 <IsambardPrince> It's all about power and control over the user.
22:19:03 <IsambardPrince> That's not what I call "security".
22:19:56 <IsambardPrince> If this "Web Platform Integrity" thing goes through, I figure it will be the end of SeaMonkey. Everything that's basically a "document viewer".
22:23:31 <tomman> yay blackouts
22:23:33 <tomman> BUT!
22:23:39 <tomman> this time my search engines stuck!
22:23:57 <tomman> Wikipedia EN survived a restart! Yahoo AR is not back!
22:39:19 <IsambardPrince> Google figures out various ways to screw around with SeaMonkey.
22:39:26 <IsambardPrince> Using DuckDuckGo actually works though.
22:49:44 <CaptainTobin> duckduckgo results tend to suck tho
22:50:57 <CaptainTobin> google results when the bias isn't driven up so high are still best results over any other and as long as their technology is still superior to everyone elses they won't be stopped by a few here and there not using it