05:05:36 <CaptainTobin> aaaaand this is back
05:05:38 <CaptainTobin> http://thereisonlyxul.org/
05:06:58 <CaptainTobin> I hope it does better than it did previously.. Likely more valuable as a common point of reference for the increasingly disperate community offerings.. just need to keep the Tobin Factor to a minimum and I think it will be useful again
05:08:14 <CaptainTobin> XULvolution in all its forms.. kinda makes you feel i dunno more optimistic
05:12:05 <CaptainTobin> top menu will likely become something akin to Front Page | Around the XULsphere (posts about releases and happenings) | BinOC Resources | SM Resources | MCP Resources | Additional Resources
05:12:18 <CaptainTobin> but i need to do a dropdown.. wonder if that menu is still compatible with the later BinOC modifications .. have to look into it
06:28:05 <CaptainTobin> HEY FRG
06:29:14 <CaptainTobin> best stop SeaMonkey, according to Waterfox Classic being based on gecko/56 means backporting security updates is difficult if not impossible.
06:29:42 <CaptainTobin> and that is why it is now abandoned
12:30:03 <hardys> frg_Away: with the last beta from Bill a bug was introduced. The preview in the Taskbar no longer works for the browser window, the mail window is not affected. Please see: https://imgur.com/a/dvprS5j
12:32:13 <hardys> frg_Away: this is on Windows 10 prof x64. It worked with the build from 01.02.23
12:34:02 <hardys> frg_Away: disabled hardware acceleration and cache but no change :(
14:52:48 <mike747> Hi, does anyone know what happened to news.aioe.org/nntp.aioe.org? Seems to be down since two weeks now. I'm asking because it is recommended on the SeaMonkey website and I used it for quite a while now. Is there an alternative news server that hosts alt.comp.software.seamonkey?
15:12:08 <njsg> mike747: RAID failure
15:12:29 <njsg> mike747: https://wiki.mozilla.org/User:Njsg/News_providers
15:13:25 <njsg> mike747: if you choose eternal-september, be sure to check the (account settings) option to always authenticate, otherwise you won't see the full list of groups
15:16:34 <mike747> I'll try these. Thanks a lot!
16:57:09 <frg_Away> hardys I will take a look. See an NS_ERROR_FAILURE in the log
18:57:34 <CaptainTobin> hi frg_Away
18:57:57 <frg_Away> CaptainTobin Hi
18:58:25 <CaptainTobin> so i was thinking about SM specific resources to add to the menu of thereisonlyxul the status meetings is one.. how relevant is MDN vs UDN sources?
18:58:49 <CaptainTobin> link to build instructions and the repo too would be nice i suspect
18:59:55 <CaptainTobin> frg_Away: any other suggestions?
19:00:05 <frg_Away> I am seldom looking at mdn any longer. It has become generic. I usually just search via search engine.
19:00:09 <CaptainTobin> older resources that still apply that could be useful to one of all of us
19:01:15 <CaptainTobin> there is that one resource wolfbeast likes to link specifically when it comes to extension scopes and mozilla.cfg
19:01:23 <CaptainTobin> you remember what that guy's name was?
19:01:49 <frg_Away> CaptainTobin no unfortunately.
19:01:52 <CaptainTobin> nuke would know but he ain't gonna tell me.. heh
19:02:34 <CaptainTobin> sigh.. likely have to use google site search and search the damned forum i guess.. later
19:04:20 <frg_Away> planet xul and all the other older stuff is mostly dead. Has Waterfox Classic been declared dead oficially too?
19:04:30 <CaptainTobin> effectively
19:04:42 <CaptainTobin> they say it is impossible to backport security fixes
19:05:04 <CaptainTobin> so they left a list of bug numbers and say patches welcome.. and no tangible activiy since end of november
19:05:44 <CaptainTobin> frg_Away: do people still believe backporting security patches is impossible after everything?
19:06:48 <frg_Away> CaptainTobin well most patches I have recently seen are regression patches. So it is impossible to backport if the original bug is not in :)
19:10:14 <frg_Away> I find things like the clipboard api an unifixable security hazard is implemented . So feeling safe without such stuff :)
19:10:57 <CaptainTobin> that is why I was all about the UXP Mozilla Security Patch summery.. since wolfbeast didn't want to just use the Mozilla commit message and kinda hide em away as common one off patches I insisted that be tracked each cycle.. Indeed my insistance on realigning the release cycle to major minor major minor was in an effort to both reduce time spent on release engineering but also to catch every security bug as soon as possible to explicitly combat that
19:10:57 <CaptainTobin> old and insecure mantra so we listed number of bugs that fixed vulnerablitys, defense in depth where the fix is only important if other changes expose it, and those that don't apply due to not being vulnerable or plum not even having the whole component
19:13:14 <CaptainTobin> besides, backporting mozilla security fixes was an accomplishment because very few actual NEW holes were ever opened up by our efforts.. so UXP gets more and more secure while mozilla basically remains perpetually zero sum
19:13:24 <CaptainTobin> it was nice
19:15:01 <CaptainTobin> oh.. frg_Away i am gonna give you the UXP version of weave not the additionally modified GRE turned ARE version
19:15:46 <CaptainTobin> cause if your syncui worked with it pre-fxa it should JUST WORK with it now but if not i know where reference code is to resolve it
19:16:13 <CaptainTobin> this will be faster and more consistant with your workflow if it isn't supercustomized just has the amo integration disabled/killed
19:16:29 <CaptainTobin> SEE frg_Away I CAN ADAPT
19:16:33 <CaptainTobin> I MAY BE BORG AFTER ALL!
19:17:15 <frg_Away> CaptainTobin I suspect most bad stuff is now in the third party stuff. Trying to get gfx updates in as fast as possible usually.
19:17:49 <CaptainTobin> indeed
19:18:07 <CaptainTobin> we should also get you on 2022 or at least 2022 capable
19:18:30 <CaptainTobin> should be fairly trivial just needs DONE i suspect
19:19:20 <CaptainTobin> it would be valuable to have everyone capable of being on the same compiler VERSION for comprative reference
19:19:40 <CaptainTobin> i think so
19:19:44 <CaptainTobin> anyway
19:20:27 <CaptainTobin> frg_Away: a huge swath of your platform is far closer to me and them than it is to mozilla my friend ;)
19:20:37 <CaptainTobin> current day*
19:21:16 <CaptainTobin> seems UXP identified some specific caveat regarding windows 32bits and 2022
19:21:30 <frg_Away> CaptainTobIn it is the one bug I mentioned previously currently.
19:21:33 <CaptainTobin> have to specify a slightly older version or it just won't run on older hardware or some shit
19:21:36 <CaptainTobin> YES
19:21:36 <CaptainTobin> ok
19:21:47 <CaptainTobin> why did i think those were two seperate things
19:22:46 <frg_Away> as for 32 bit it can go the way of the dodo. My oldest T61 Thinkpad from 2008 is running Windows x64 with 4GB fine.
19:22:54 <CaptainTobin> I am just gonna drop windows 32bit and gtk2 and gcc older than 10 when EL7 dies
19:23:19 <CaptainTobin> and vs older than 22
19:24:59 <frg_Away> 17 and 19 are stiff fine and being updated.
19:25:30 <CaptainTobin> sure
19:25:47 <CaptainTobin> but as one person it is difficult to support multiple compilers
19:26:40 <CaptainTobin> and I don't like leaving broken support in
19:28:52 <frg_Away> MS is doing a Windows 11 on 22. It is constantly changing. 19 is the best bet currently. Needed to work arend an ICE in 22 previously too and this has not happened in a long time before.  So yes for support bot no for dropping 19. 17 can go.
19:57:19 <CaptainTobin> frg_Away: yeah and I told Moonchild that but he didn't listen obviously.. It may have even been stated in some earlier issues.. but he has done that and I have to either deal with it by keeping 2015 or going 2019 and hoping i can solve differences or just deal by accepting 22.. whatever happens for this very moment i kinda have to just accept 22 until i know more..
19:58:43 <CaptainTobin> or things get harder than I am able to cope with right now.. later perhaps but not right now
19:58:45 <CaptainTobin> you know
19:59:09 <CaptainTobin> it was FAR easier to avoid bs like that when you were in charge of avoiding it before it happens eh?
19:59:31 <frg_Away> If 22 can compile the soruce 19 can. Don't see anything which would make updating to 22 a requirement.
20:00:43 <CaptainTobin> 22 can compile uxp.. that was based on 52.. i am sure 22 can compile your codebase especially seeing as it already went past the 2015 mark so.. you are already in better shape than most
20:01:09 <CaptainTobin> just needs to get done is all
20:01:17 <CaptainTobin> like most stuff like this
20:04:44 <frg_Away> Hardest part was to get it into moz.configure :)
20:05:33 <CaptainTobin> that bit of moz.configure is more comprehensable than others let alone the backend thgat drives it
20:07:31 <frg_Away> Problem with 22 is/was that the locations changed to the x64 directory without the x86.
20:08:22 <CaptainTobin> i wonder why the hell we couldn't just use the batch file with vswhere to just shit the paths into the same vars we always used
20:13:15 <frg_Away> hardys next build should fix it. Thanks for reporting it.
20:31:57 <CaptainTobin> let's just see if this code still compiles with 2015 str8 up sans jxr
20:32:07 <CaptainTobin> and with that one xpcom patch
20:33:15 <CaptainTobin> cause if so well i deff don't need jxr in interlink and jxr is doubious since chrome rejected it
20:34:34 <CaptainTobin> i have a feeling it won't like JS
21:47:44 <CaptainTobin> frg_Away: you know in another decade or two there will be an episode on history channel of ancient aliens asking if ancient aliens created the first browser
21:48:17 <CaptainTobin> and that MCSA Mosiac is based on ancient source code from a tablet that no longer exists
21:48:35 <frg_Away> already happened in dimension X123AFG
21:48:44 <CaptainTobin> LOL
21:48:49 <CaptainTobin> Fucking amazing
21:49:31 <CaptainTobin> I quite enjoyed that.
22:07:36 <frg_Away> hardys fixed it
22:07:42 <hardys> frg_Away: Thanks for fixing, I will try the new build tomorrow. Do beta testing every day
22:08:43 <frg_Away> needed to remove a patch. Not sure why this one caused the failure but was not essential for now. Just fluff for later stuff.
22:11:29 <hardys> I think it is a good thing to report this "zeitnah" so you know where to look for based on your latest bug fixes
22:12:24 <frg_Away> hardys yes. I would probably have spotted this one too soon but was about to move things around which would have made it harder.
22:51:27 <frg_Away> Last status meeting notes are up. Sorry for the delay again:
22:51:28 <frg_Away> https://wiki.mozilla.org/SeaMonkey/StatusMeetings/2023-01-15
22:51:30 <frg_Away> https://wiki.mozilla.org/index.php?title=SeaMonkey%2FStatusMeetings%2F2023-01-15&action=historysubmit&type=revision&diff=1245409&oldid=1245199