tomman: supposedly Redirector works for Wikipedia. I don't use this one, but per /r/wikipedia: Pattern: *.wikipedia.org/wiki/* Redirect to: $1.wikipedia.org/wiki/$2?useskin=vector

what I *do* use is greasemonkey 3.9.0.1rc1pre so if anyone knows of a wikipedia userscript that works with this relic it would be appreciated. This one doesn't: gist.github.com/Vusys/a9451ee719e27a4eb1fc05dcb2e60588

Does anyone offer a 2.53.15 that supports iso8601 besides buc? Anyone know if or when bug will offer 2.53.15?

email him

either that or make a redhat Bugzilla RFE

he'll have a FAS account which will have a @fedoraproject.org email account to it. email it if you can find it

CaptainTobin I do all my builds in a vm. I just bought NVMe drives to see if this would speed up things but the boost was neglectable. A SATA SSD is good enough. I doubt a ram disk would help. In my opionion cores and higher clock is all what matters.

I am waiting for that mythical 1024-core Ryzen~

(but would settle right now even with a quadcore one...)

tomman I don't buy amd any longer. graphics card drivers are crap under Windows and the workstation processors might be locked to a vendor when you buy them used.

ah, the legacy of ATi drivers from hell

at least on Linux we got it better, what I'm not buying ever again is noVideo

I don't buy new Intel too so we are even here :)

too bad Intel dropped the ball BADLY with Arc

I guess Intel is cursed and will be forever doomed to the IGP arena

tomman Intel gfx is and was the pits.

they could have given both noVideo and AMD a run for its money, and instead... we got another i740

decent-ish hardware, horrible drivers

For my Linux server I bought a used AMD RX480 card. I should probaly state that I don't buy amd processors and gfx only used when cheap.

Nvidia and Linux = super urkkk...

so, SeaMonkey for RISC-V when?! :D

arm first :)

I guess the Year of RISC-V in the Desktop™ is coming after the Year of ARM in the Desktop™, aka "when pigs fly"

however, I also don't see RISC-V in my next cellphone either

tomman yeahh. I looked at arm stuff just to see if I can buy a cheap builder for testing. What is available outside of rack servers is overpriced junk. Think I might be able to run a Linux vm on the mac mini M1 but no time yet to check.

habemus release?!

yay~!!!!

yup

If you are building 2.53.15 on freeBSD: bugzilla.mozilla.org/1811421

If not just ignore.

no breakages to report on my backup amd64/Debian setup

time to restart this

tomman Some problem reported with greasemonkey but no specifics. Don't use it so can't comment.

tomman Some problem reported with greasemonkey but no specifics. Don't use it so can't comment.

same either

Monkeyfix and SeaFox don't seem to require new fixes

lemme check Palefill

still working (with updates disabled, of course)

CaptainTobin Hi ircbot.comm-central.org:8080/seamonkey/20230121#c206608

Retro question: what was the last version of SeaMonkey that supported Win98/Me?

need to load another browser on my PCChips junk for fun

frg_Away: cert is expired

on the 7th

yes needs an exception

just letting you know in case you were operating from an older exception Let's Subvert certs only last what 3 months?

ah frg_Away

well 2018 nvme interface isn't as sure fire as the current boards

i dunno if something quirky will happen or not

sata m.2 are quirky when drive access is between m.2 and other sata drives

i just wanted to use a ram drive for winders builds cause it might be somewhat faster and also less thrashy on a platter drive or .. I/O blocking on ssd

I am seriously considering dropping back to regular sata

not m.2

at least the 2017-2018 hardware i have doesn't seem 100% fleshed out or sorted

but a bios update might help but that is another risk.. there have been issues with the firmware last few years

so it would be more of a gamble than it should be imo

that is why i ask frg_Away

i likely won't be getting a next generation system for reasons of cost and i am not gonna fuckin deal with lga in any form

pins belong on the CHIP

they only did this to drive more people out of the build your own shit arena

obsensively to tablets and commiefones

there is no physical or technological reason that makes pins on the motherboard superior

in fact it makes the motherboard that much more expensive and harder to use with more risk in assembly

On a 2017 Haswell with an X10DAi. Best board I ever owned. LGA is a bit fragile but not changing cpus more than once or twice.

yeah but this isn't an era where one can just buy a cheap amd ryzen gen 5 and test your hand at it before buying the good shit

and intel isn't any indication of what amd is doing

cause patents won't allow it

it has to be different and have its own selection of bullshit along with common issues

frg_Away: is any of this actually making sense outside my own head?

I bought only used Xeons in the last few years.

i can still get a much better processor for this board.. just requires a firmware update..

the whole world is conspiring to be unkind as a lifestyle choice

i am convinced frg_Away

uh, LGA has been used on all Intel desktop platforms since Prescott... over 15 years ago

yes nice

wonderful

and amd is new at it

and it isn't identical

and word is it is MORE fragile than intel

so..

YEAH tomman that is my problem

but yeah, straightening a bent pin on a chip is hard, but on a socket it's simply impossible

it is expensive regardless it is new for amd and i have no experience at all with it and tutorials won't help

i have a solution

don't bend socket pins

it is very easy NOT TO

but basically BREATHING on lga fucks it up

practically

I was sorting out some parts earlier today and found a socket cover for LGA775

i shouldn't need to cover up anything on a main board

that is another issue

also I heard AMD's latest Socket SP5 (for EPYC) is basically a monster of over SIX THOUSAND LGA PINS

Intel only "maxes out" at ~4K pins

(while sockets are a long gone dream on mobile platforms, sadly - Intel left sockets behind after Haswell)

maybe if they weren't looking to design processors for fucking artifical idiocy .. we could have processors with practical tangible real world gains powering the technology and software we aren't ALLOWED to have and are attacked for trying to create

or hold on to

tomman:

tell Intel to not change the goddamned socket after every generation

they have been pulling this BS since... oh, Socket 1

gotta love the longlived Socket 7, which not only span a few generations, but also had actual competition on the same socket!

Well you will all love the new ram standard: notebookcheck.net/CAMM-memory-previ…ell-SODIMM-revolution.658666.0.html

tell the usb people to stop fucking with a backwards compatible standard that is actually one of the most reasonable and successful cable standards globally ever created past coax and rca

what is that some half-assed rambus clone only even stupider?

rambus with AI

"CAMM was designed specifically to overcome the aforementioned performance limits of SODIMM while reducing both Z height and routing traces on the PCB to ultimately allow for laptops with both faster RAM and thinner profiles."

New a jedec standard: pcworld.com/article/1473126/camm-th…e-of-laptop-memory-has-arrived.html

> thinner profiles

effectively i bet

who's asking for thinner laptops?!?!?!?!?!

oh

well watch for AI reimagined rambus ram coming eventually

ah, more LGA connectors

i am calling it

LGA RAM?!

bdrfeuyi8wsgvbtfliuwgbf;law

I'm done.. i am erasing everything from 2019 on

it is now 2018

it has always BEEN 2019

18

also those modules are ridiculously big

which are anachronistic for laptops

reminds me of ancient Pentium-era proprietary RAM cards

big modules to solve the problem of small modules being too big

is that literally what you told me

?

notebookcheck.net/fileadmin/_proces…sed_/1/0/csm_MG_7461_f9a7f94bde.jpg OK, I genuinely like this

screwed up your LGA pins? Just swap the socket!

why we can't have that for CPUs too!?

ok yes

THIS makes sense

pressure pins

on contact board

very hard to fuck up

of course many OEMs will solder that thing for "reliability reasons"

getting us back to square one

tomman: you wanna write for BinOC lol

put all this shit out there

I also don't like the fact that the huge footprint of CAMM modules restrict laptops to a single socket

of course Apple doesn't care about sockets, and it has been that way all the way back to the original Mac 128K

this will make RAM upgrades costlier

i mean i like the concept as implimented but how does this solve the issue of the SODIMM even if soldering it on is your hidden plan

ram is already too expensive

and if it comes with rainbow puke lights it is even twice as much for NO REASON

but again..

HEY

does that look like the width of two sodimms?

Another reason why I buy workstation stuff. Used ECC ram is cheap and the Xeons have more memory channels so basically still good to go even 2023

Or even 3 SODIMMs side by side

you can stack SODIMM slots too

yeah so while I like the concept how does this solve anything except not having to have 2-3 slot mechisms and everything being one module

I get the physics restrictions of pushing SODIMMs faster and denser, but... everything else looks dumber

why not just make "hybrid" modules that can be stacked then?

maybe if someone came up with one that had a couple of slots on the top side under the screws

make them LGA if you want, surround the module with a ring of LGA pins, like stacked PCBs

this looks like pressure contact pin contacts

not pins at all really

like.. cell phone batteries

it's a shame pogo pins are unfeasible for most electronics applications

that is what this reminds me of

battery contacts as pins

and i approve.. but i am not sure it makes sense HERE

why can't we just go back to slut processors

that solves a lot of issues

and sluts are more popular than ever with the dimm.2 and successor bullshit interfaces

so pga makes even LESS sense

As having played recently with a dual Slot 1/Socket 370 mobo, my opinion on slotted CPUs is... hybrid

whtever connector on a board in a slut?

they take space and are annoying to mount, but so are socketed fansinks

--heatsinks

whtever connector on a board in a slut?

that would be lovely

Intel tried fixing the world with Slot 1, and had to give up as soon as they found how to put L2 cache on die

then if you ARE fucking with a connector that bends when you breath on it least you can isolate JUST that bit until it is safe to handle

I owned a slot 2 board too

the only thing I hate from Socket 370 is their horrendously fragile exposed flip-chip dies and how tight are the heatsink clips on S370 coolers

how about we have a cpu board, ram board, an m.2 board, and get a fuck ton of shit OFF the mainboard

THAT is how our forefathers built computers and it worked for them

Apple did that for years, and so did IBM on their enterprisey iron

the mobo wasn't a mobo but a backplane

because it makes fuckin sense.. except in a throwaway consumer drone world

WHICH IS WHAT HAS LEAD US HERE

ironically ancient Apples were very upgradable

the macintosh is what ruined apple

want a PPC CPU on your 68K? Just put it in on the PDS slot!

more steve jobs bullshit

thanks steve

heh, reminds me that story when Burrell Smith tried to sneak in a slot on the original Mac

Jobs shot down that every time he found it

the GS line is the TRUE evolution of apple technology.. the lisa and macintosh were wrong.

and it was superior to the classic mac

Burrell's only design win was to leave the extra two address lines for the upcoming 64K memory chips

so you could upgrade your 128K Mac to 512K... by using a soldering iron

but Jobs wanted APPLIANCES, not COMPUTERS

these people don't care about technology only what how much power it can give them to push their more radical bullshit

that didn't ended well between Smith and Jobs

oh late 80s sure it was appliances

just like attempts to ship older computers as cutrate video game consoles didn't work out

watch the nextstep launch and then watch the OSX launch

it is almost identical

point for point

demo for demo

and now with the ARMacs, we're back full circle

only difference is replace nextstep with apple and a user interface with jello

you get some USB/TB ports, and that's all

google and microsoft will push these arm service devices as if apple does it first then neither can be held for anti-trust

that is what changed

apple became the test case and president starter

THIS is why Microsoft bailed them out in the first place

but google has made the token compeditor concept successful in a way microsoft never did.. now microsoft just lets google use apple and then microsoft uses google and in turn google gets second only to microsoft priority on the OS

until google can kill microsoft

which the way its going.. looks like a real possiblity that microsoft will end up as a peer of Mozilla in Google's eyes and worldwide influence

who would have imagined that

and still nerds rage over Bill Gates, who has now even divorced (and in risk of losing some of his private jets)

microsoft on its own we could deal with.. especially when it was more about simple greed than world wide destruction as a long term business strategy

I think Billy boy was corrupted in turn for basically the microsoft anti-trust case having no actual long term consiquences

the difference between Google and MS is that MS was opt-out, while Google was opt-in, and everybody opted in!

and that is why he is such the disgusting creature he is today

rather than the geek with a mild power seeking mentality to make up for being a geek

and now I get why retrocomputing is on the rise

compare gates in the early 90s with when he was in court to today

are they really the same man on a fundamental level?

Windows 98 is starting to look lovely again :D

Windows 2000 was the best the 90s mustered

and windows 2000 is the ONLY reason we are even in a somewhat workable position still

IF the NT kernel had stayed nt4 like or even stayed xp-corrupted would it have lasted?

Windows 2000 is the bar.. the milestone to meet.. the server team never forgot that

well until they were sucked into azure or fired

while Steve Ballmer himself has done his own share of creature devolution him self.. in the 2000s he was top of his game.. and his vision was doing realllly well up until he put the guy who fucked up office in charge of windows and after fixing vista low hanging fruit fucked us up to where we are now

like i said before.. i knew shit was going wrong fundamentally when most of Microsoft's sites went wordpress and some with bootstrap js or wordpress WITH bootstrap js.. that plus metro and THAT is why I got so worried in 2010-2011

tomman: so when are we gonna just all band together and create an OS that actually works and makes sense

you know.. if the web and email are off the table.. i would totally consider going back and forking 1.9.2

and start reverting xpinstall's depercation

or more likely 1.9.0

i can take 1.9.0 to 1.9.2 without screwing over xpinstall

i am sure

oh 1.9.0 was already reduced

well 1.8.1 isn't too old LOL

> The last version with Windows 98/Me support was SeaMonkey 1.1.19.

wonder how much of the Modern Web™ works on it...

(on IE6, pretty much no site using SSL will open nowadays)

so gecko/1.8

1.1 was still xpfe

with full xpinstall

tomman not much. Have it in a 98se vm. One step above a doormat only.

i figured out how to get win2k to install in vmware on ryzen

I've got two bare metal 9x setups for toying here: one with 98SE and another with ME

takes a bit of work

and i adhoc'd it with an already working nt4 vm

but i can do it that way from clean install

tomman still use it on a T42 with my second eprom burner. Can do 2532 and 2532A unlike the better one.

windows 98 tho i can't get to work

on vmware on ryzen

wow, there is no es-ES langpack for 1.1.19

not much intrest for me in 9x anyway.. except for the exrteme hack that inspired Windows PE that used 9x as the base

tomman: 1.1 was early days

literally gecko and suite after mozilla discontinued it the seamonkey project was barely operational

maybe it's time to revive 9x... where YOU owned your computer... and all the skript kiddies on the block too! :D

it wasn't until the toolkit transition did we see a short golden age of suite

okno

but we all know what happened 10 years ago

cause i never shut up about it

lol

Lemme recap my history

got online in 2001

used NS4 side by side with IE5.5

then moved to Mozilla Suite as soon as there was a release that would not crash on my Celery with WinMe

(that was circa 2002-2003)

i first got online in a modern sense with windows 3.1 trumpet winsock and mosiac netscape 0.9 on a 286 upgraded to a 386sx

before that internet connected BBS a total of ONCE

can't remember which version it was, most likely 0.x?

then switched to Firefox in late 2004 (after the Olympics)

Firefox was a good product until it became the RIGHT product the ONLY product

also in the 0.x's - stayed there until The Destruction Of Mozilla™ began with FF4

that mattered

ran 3.6 for as long as I could, until I learned that I could turn FF10 into FF3.6 with some easy mods

the destruction of Mozilla swung into full swing the moment Firefox 3 went out the door

and Firefox 3 was manipulated badly from the ux team

then I finally jumped ship after the Australis tragedy

the band of crybaby mac users who made the first inroads into screwing us all

and now, like a good children comes back to home, I came back to what's now known as Seamonkey sometime around 2015

frg_Away is aware of this but did not witness it

IanN_Away however did

well we have our own visions and priorities and i have FINALLY accepted that.

Australis was what made me abandon Firefox for good, because there was no way to get my classic UI back there

and even back then Google Chrome was "just" a threat, not the new IE

Australis was just the jump the shark pretense in marketing after that pretense has been stripped

Google is a threat because it has too much power over the planet either directly or via partners and constripts

conscripts

BUT Google isn't the end of the line

and I don't know WHERE it goes past google exactly

and it is a lot harder NOW to have a chance to find out than it was before but the priority wasn't as high before

I mean, back when I dumped FF for SM, web compatibility wasn't a problem YET

because Google and friends weren't pushing out new half baked standards every week

what it is is we are all really fuckin stupid as a species.. denial and apathy and going along purely out of fear of being excluded.. these are the core issues of why evil keeps rising time and time again

JavaScript usage was not as heavy

and devs were focused on cellphones, not on turning the web browser into the next OS (ironically something where MS failed miserably)

it all became a pandemic in the last 4 years

when developers switched toolchains to the insanity of node.js and folks

where your website is just a Git commit away from breaking in production

the pandemic was always planned.. the only thing in question is how much of covid was engineered and how much was simply taken advantage of

we been planning pandemics ever since the concept materalized

sometimes it is just a controlled messure of exposer for immunity.. sometimes it is because we fucked up bad.. and sometimes it is because someone wants to fuck us all

fun fact.. the previous scares like west nile, birdflu, swineflu, mad cow disese.. all shit that happened but all shit that was also exploited as far as people would allow.. so really.. a vast majority must want this because they keep allowing it to continue

and if anyone raises an issue even if all the new strats fail.. one can always fall back on historic outbreaks like the black death

there is always a way to fear monger and exploit a situation .. just if it is worth bothering seems to be the only real factor

well I think I am gonna add my own section of BinOC Standards

and assume defacto authority over XUL and Mozilla's RDF and XBL

who better?

;)

kinda like I assumed defacto authority over DOMi but ONLY DOMi

it is a percision tool

not a club

Who wants HTML 4.9

just installed on Me

oh, there WAS a splashscreen!

surprisingly Google keeps a HTTP-only search portal

HTTPS still works there too

unsurprisingly, SeaMonkey's own homepage won't load anymore

but Hackernews DO open

mozilla.org loads

1.1.19 does open far more websites than IE6SP1, so there is that

would not do my banking or email there, but for casual browsing of non-Googledamaged websites it's OK

xpfe's version of apprunner had a splash screen

they removed it along with the resident agent

> a vast majority must want this because they keep allowing it to continue

Sounds like Qanus stuff which is a channel I will never subscribe too. Was bound to happen and will happen again. Only luck here was the low mortility rate but even this was enough to almost overwhelm the hospitals here.

well i am open to other explainations but the effect of it can't happen to me or it has nothing to do with me and it is what it is are just dangerous mindsets in times of peace and penty as much as in times of death and destruction

Wikipedia won't load, it wants a newer crypto and says it outright

the poor kids at Guinea won't be able to learn :/

they just want newer crypto to hide what it is doing on the user side

I wanted to see how the latest UI/UX vomit of Wikipedia's redesign broke on vintage PCs

part of the eventual future of a website being nothing but a blackbox bunch of bytecode you execute to use their service..

now I will never learn!

well, most websites have reached that point

so .. blackbox js is ok but remote xul is bad .. xul period is bad.. right?

they no longer serve straight HTML, but a soup of toxic JS framework-of-the-week and the body as a JSON payload

tomman:

that is still the state of things correct?

i been out of the loop on what I am and are not allowed to think

and as soon as there is a script error (due to unimplemented Chromeisms or some Git commit gone bad at a upstream dependency), you get NOTHING on screen

many sites now break in that fashion on our browsers

like webmin

even stuff as blogs

webmin

on the gray framed theme

had js menu dependant on some node lib

from some cdn

or something to that effect

i just wanted to make sure webmin knew it is more than just Moonchild bitching

Or something like MercadoLibre, where the pages will render more or less OK without JS, but with JS you get served static HTML... and half a megabyte of THE SAME PAGE CONTENTS as JSON payload!

i think the VERY first xul project i should do that is new is a clone of the Program Manager

(this is why I don't bother selling stuff online there anymore... well, that and their asinine anticustomer policies)

well HTML 4.9 and Eichscript 5.9

those are gonna be my standards

the engine is capable of more but those I am gonna codify into BinOC Standards

someone has to have some after all

well, my vintage PCChips mobo is pretty much done for now

WinMe runs like a champion without crashing twice per hour

it even got a DVD decoder card,complete with analog TV noise!

vintage Office 97/2K and SeaMonkey seal the deal

too bad I can't use the DVD decoding features of the chipset (SiS 630) because they're... how I would say, FAKE NEWS!

Windows ME can run fine in a very limited range of hardware or with specific oem care.. it however was NOT primed to replace Windows 98 SE on a global scale.. to do so would have rendered ME pointless in its entirety

I also have the exact same payload on a 98SE setup on a second HDD

i think ME was a stopgap first.. and 9x perceptual manipulation second

ME bad.. 9x bad bsod.. Wow Windows XP!

that IS how it happened but was it planned

went from "some 98 beta" -> 95 -> Me -> XP -> 7 -> end of road

DOS and Windows 3.1 to 95 to 98 to 98se to 2000 to whistler to whistler 2416 to 2000 to xp sp2 to windows 7 build 6--something the one that leaked before 7000 was released

now I am on LTSC 2021

i am not looking forward to overriding and defining a style that is sane but doesn't clash too badly with windows 11's lack of a design aesthetic

for shit like popupmenus

at the VERY least

windows classic context menus have been stylefucked to promote the context menu that hides everything you want

and uses newer apis not gdi emulated with dwm

but directui

well whatever shit they have over directui

anyway

CaptainTobin There is a reg patch for this but even then the taskbar is fubar. Will probably update to Server 2022 from 2019 and then we will see. Supported till 2031 and probably the last semi usable Windows.

Or I buy the farm before. You never know.

Well i may just give up on explorer as a shell

write a program manager, file manager, task manager, and just work like it's 1993

but with xul

LOL

PERSONALLY I think navigator.xul's inhearent layout and design makes it a perfect canidate to become the base UI for a lot of shit.. the sidebar, the toolbar, statusbar, menu, customizable.. JUST the tab content needs changed..

and there needs to be a way to tie a global toolbar and children to different KINDS of tabs.. ala IE 4

pretty much the majority of my intended applications save a program manager SEEMS to need a toolbox a sidebar and tabs

THAT sounds like the makings of a global main-window one can overlay

if it makes sense to do so

standard base UIs to include standard base widgets.. deviation is always possible but if it makes sense to use it may as well use the same one

frg_Away: sorry

i get all idealistic with this shit

even in the face of darker times to come

anyone have an indiction cooktop or portable burner for one

are they any good?

Freind has an induction one for ages. He liked it then. But needed new cooking pots for it. But was about 18 years agao so anything new should work with them.

Quote fro the net: Induction cooktops do not work with non-ferromagnetic cookware.